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Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby bokki on Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:02 pm

its my fault
im very sorry

thank you for the compassion
bodhisattvas

please understand
that you are deeply loved

:ghug:
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby jundo on Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:18 pm

macdougdoug wrote:It was meant to be funny.
I remembered a guru who stayed silent for a few seconds after being asked a question, and his silence was taken as a fabulous symbolic statement about the truth and such.
Just old memories, awkward at the time but gives me the giggles now.


Reminds me of when (true story) I first came to Japan and met my first Japanese "Zen Master" (my first teacher, Azuma Roshi of Sojiji). I promptly proceeded to ask him the big questions, one of which was "What is Time? What is the "NOW"?"

His answer: "Time is Now 5:30"

Wow, I thought. HOW PROFOUND! He must mean "time is just what it is!" and it is "Now! Just this moment, 5:30!!"

Instead, I soon realized that his English was not so good, and he just thought I was asking what time it was.

Actually, there are a lot of things like that in many of our favorite English Zen Books by Asian Masters who often struggled with English (as I struggle the other way teaching Japanese folks in Japanese), such as Shunryu Suzuki, Katagiri Roshi, Seung Sahn perhaps and many others. I think books like "Zen Mind Beginners Mind", for all their Wisdom, are also filled here and there with "profound statements" where I am pretty sure it was Suzuki just trying to say something in English and failing, maybe translating in his head too closely tracking Japanese grammar and literal wording.

Anyway ...

Gassho, J
Last edited by jundo on Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby jundo on Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:26 pm

bokki wrote:its my fault
im very sorry

thank you for the compassion
bodhisattvas

please understand
that you are deeply loved

:ghug:


Hi Bokki,

If you have a medical condition or the like that requires you to communicate so, I offer Metta and apologize, and I am sorry to disturb you. I am just trying to understand what is going on with some of the folks here.

It seems that almost nobody is left here at ZFI, and the conversations that are happening are truly in left field even for Zen folks.

Gassho, Jundo
Founder Treeleaf Zendo, Japan. Member SZBA. Treeleaf is an online Sangha for those unable to commute to a Sangha, w/ netcast Zazen, interaction with other practitioners and teachers & all activities of a Soto Sangha, fully online without charge (http://www.treeleaf.org) Nishijima/Niwa
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby organizational on Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:55 pm

jundo wrote:"What is Time? What is the "NOW"?"

answer: "Time is Now 5:30"



Very good indeed! :peace: Gassho to Azuma roshi.

I think he meaned that there is no time out of now.
as you mention
But i also wonder your thoughts; What do you think about
there is no time out of now?

And 5:30
I'm sure it has a meaning too but what ???
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby macdougdoug on Sat Apr 15, 2017 7:32 pm

:rbow:

Depends : am or pm ?

Even more confusing, over here its 20:32 (aka 8:32 pm)

:daisy:
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby organizational on Sat Apr 15, 2017 7:45 pm

here it is 21:43

:heya:
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby organizational on Sat Apr 15, 2017 8:01 pm

jundo wrote:
bokki wrote:its my fault
im very sorry

thank you for the compassion
bodhisattvas

please understand
that you are deeply loved

:ghug:


Hi Bokki,

If you have a medical condition or the like that requires you to communicate so, I offer Metta and apologize, and I am sorry to disturb you. I am just trying to understand what is going on with some of the folks here.

It seems that almost nobody is left here at ZFI, and the conversations that are happening are truly in left field even for Zen folks

Gassho, Jundo


If there is anyone who has a medical condition its me.
I'm suffering heavily from a mental disorder.And one of the outcome bonus i've is sth like severely traumatized stress disorder.continuosly.

my recent injury was yesterday.

bows
forum may want to know
Last edited by organizational on Sat Apr 15, 2017 8:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby flutemaker on Sat Apr 15, 2017 8:10 pm

jundo wrote:It seems that almost nobody is left here at ZFI, and the conversations that are happening are truly in left field even for Zen folks.

Jundo:

You also wrote,
jundo wrote:You need to do your own heavy lifting.

Perhaps, some folks choose to proceed exactly that way, so that for the "conversations", sometimes, they feel no energy, nor desire, nor even slight inclination. Especially, if there is a feeling of "fruitless" nature of such undertaking. If we can speak of some things "fruitful" at all.

Perhaps, some other folks, on the opposite, feel that they've "got" something, and are way too busy jumping up and down about that, so there is not much time remaining to hang around here.

While yet another people, who feel the same like you do, are just silently awaiting, keeping their mouth shut, in hopes there will be some real activity here of such kind that they [and you, and may others] welcome.

Meanwhile, while yes, for some unknown reason, all [strange] kind of folks are attracted to "spiritual" forums, how does one clearly distinguish what is what? And even if one can, should the forum be "cleaned" of all and every "suspicious" user? And what would be the right criteria for such a cleaning?

I would be very much pleased to share your, and many other's here, company in person, but there are circumstances preventing me from doing so.

So.. just hang around here.. or leave.. or just do none of these..

Blessings,

FM
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby Michaeljc on Sat Apr 15, 2017 8:29 pm

It seems that almost nobody is left here at ZFI, and the conversations that are happening are truly in left field even for Zen folks.


Which brings up an important point in the dynamics of this forum (IMO)

We are from very different backgrounds, cultures, languages ................ Jokes fall flat, offense taken when none was intended, courtesy interpreted as criticism or sarcasm, wisdom seen as ignorance - all such can happen

One of the attractions of ZFI for me is getting to know the person behind the words. Depending on their input it takes time, a lot of time. Slowly but slowly their story shows through. IMO we need a least a year of contributions before seeing the character and true intent of their words shine through

We have also to deal with communication norms of different cultures: The Japanese, where "yes" can mean "no"; the Americans where witty one-liners and revelation of the most personal of details is a norm. Then the French, where in-ya-face debate is an art-form (black is white) and the calculated pragmatism of the northern Europeans. The sensitive passion of the Slavs. We also have communication from those without English as a first language

Humour is where these differences show up most. It comes from deep within culture and seldom exports

IMO most of the bust-ups here have been due to misunderstanding of meaning and intent which is so much influenced by a background that we cannot see - only feel. We have no body language or physical expression to go by

How different it would be should we be all sitting around a large table where smartphones were banned

Therefore this all comes down to not just interpretation of meaning but our own perception - could it be wrong? Oh yes!

Just some burble

m

PS - It turned out that flutemaker and I posted simultaneously. We are on the same latitude be it the Pacific Ocean apart :)
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby Guo Gu on Sat Apr 15, 2017 9:08 pm

jundo wrote:I have my personal feeling on this, but I will keep it to myself and walk my way.


jundo,
your personal feelings are already evident in the posts. :)
i hear you brother.
though i must say, there is a time, place, and person who appropriately exercise what you refer to as jifeng 機鋒 or "pivotal encounter" to help practitioners. but if the occasion misses the point and it is inappropriately used, then there is no real transformative outcome.
be well,
guo gu
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http://www.tallahasseechan.com/
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby lobster on Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:56 am

organizational wrote:If there is anyone who has a medical condition its me.
I'm suffering heavily from a mental disorder.And one of the outcome bonus i've is sth like severely traumatized stress disorder.continuosly.

my recent injury was yesterday.

bows
forum may want to know


:heya:

Thanks for mentioning. :Namaste:
That is hard to deal with. Zen as one of the more austere, extreme and direct confrontations would do will to have trained psychologists/psychiatrists and doctors as part of its filtering.

However what do we crazies offer in return? :hide: What filers do we have? :)
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Re: Zen Clapdoodle and the Coo Coo Cachoo

Postby organizational on Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:40 am

There is a saying here;

"Practice with what you know -only"

If the translation is good.

So i'm just practicing with what i know.
As an example i sometimes don't understand what is written here
at the posts, from various reasons
like having lack of fluent english or as losing my attention because of so long posts,
but i do my best and practice with what i get only.
that's what i'm doing right now,
so just give up the rest.
Simplicity is what is behind in my head®
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