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The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice)

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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby flutemaker on Fri Feb 10, 2017 5:40 pm

Guo Gu wrote:ani,
one bad case of transaction and you stop your flute business all together? i hope you continue to make and sell flutes.
regarding the indian who didn't pay you for the flute, why not just consider that a gift?
with a change of perspective, adversity becomes opportunity for you to practice generosity.
will you sell me a flute?
be well,
guo gu
Guo Gu:

I stop flute business for the purposes of user activity in the Chan section of the forum to increase. Consequently, for the robots to pick it up. Consequently for the position in the search engines to improve. I will sell you a melody beyond sound. And the 6 holes of a flute. Which currency would you pay me back?
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby flutemaker on Fri Feb 10, 2017 5:56 pm

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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby flutemaker on Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:02 pm

[james] wrote:Karma is exhaustible to the degree that you do not produce new karma. Simple, straightforward, not extraordinary.
You do not produce new karma? Congratulations!
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby flutemaker on Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:08 pm

TigerDuck wrote:Once you manage to handle those thoughts, eventually everything become easy.

Can you HANDLE thoughts?
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby [james] on Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:08 pm

flutemaker wrote:
[james] wrote:Karma is exhaustible to the degree that you do not produce new karma. Simple, straightforward, not extraordinary.
You do not produce new karma? Congratulations!


I'm weak. I produce tonnes of it
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby flutemaker on Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:17 pm

[james] wrote:
flutemaker wrote:
[james] wrote:Karma is exhaustible to the degree that you do not produce new karma. Simple, straightforward, not extraordinary.
You do not produce new karma? Congratulations!


I'm weak. I produce tonnes of it

Brother, I prefer not to talk for the purposes of just playing words. I cannot not to create karma. I cannot handle thoughts. I can sit my arse down but cannot do "meditation". Nor can I release destructive energy resulting from my encountering inexhaustible karma stream as easily as saying a word. Nor transform it in an alchemical way. Hence the practice noted in the OP is called practice.
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby desert_woodworker on Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:27 pm

James, et al.,

Vis-a-vis karma, [james] wrote:I'm weak. I produce tonnes of it.

And, note that karma has varieties. Some say, "good", and "bad" karma, but we could alternatively say "virtuous" and "troubling", as well, or use other choices of words to more precise effect.

So, it's not all "bad". Look on the bright side! ;)

Incidentally, I'd say that there is action that is not productive of karma. And that is Awakened-action. It is guided by true-Wisdom, and accompanied by true-Compassion.

As an example of a person acting this way, consider our original Teacher, Shakyamuni Buddha. After his awakening under the tree, what karma did he produce?

(a rhetorical question: I do not mean to de-rail the thread).

--Joe
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby [james] on Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:39 pm

flutemaker wrote:Brother, I prefer not to talk for the purposes of just playing words. I cannot not to create karma. I cannot handle thoughts. I can sit my arse down but cannot do "meditation". Nor can I release destructive energy resulting from my encountering inexhaustible karma stream as easily as saying a word. Nor transform it in an alchemical way. Hence the practice noted in the OP is called practice.


Yes you, and also everyone, can not create karma. How do we not create karma? By bringing our observing awareness to the karma we already have ... by seeing our reactions to the situations and circumstances that we are immersed in and by recognizing the patterns of our reactive behaviour as either wholesome or unwholesome to ourself and others and by resolving to do what is wholesome and to not do what is unwholesome. If the stream of karma were inexhaustible there would be no possibility of liberation from misery. Buddhist practice is about liberation.

As far as sitting your arse down, why can you not do meditation, that is simple observing awareness of this raw and present fact?
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby Michaeljc on Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:48 pm

Look behind the words

what is being said? :)

m
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby flutemaker on Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:07 pm

Michaeljc wrote:Look behind the words

what is being said?

m

Out to borrow a pair of true eyes to see...

Look Left! Look Right! Look Left Again! Look before you cross!
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby desert_woodworker on Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:47 pm

I think karma is combusted upon awakening. Is that true of both good and bad karma? I think so.

In the awakened state, we live right on 'the cutting edge' of karma, I like to say. Our account is cleared, and we have no assets, but neither do we have pressing debts. What we do for people and beings is in response to the spontaneous arising of wisdom and compassion, and is not a repayment of a debt, nor a means of garnering favor, but is a natural response.

--Joe
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby island on Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:45 pm

The word "acceptance" can be defined in different ways, some of which may even be opposed to each other. "Radical acceptance" is facing what is exactly as it is while "being accepting" implies a more passive stance, to give into what is. We are conditioned in many ways about anger. Buddhism teaches some aspects of anger as a poison. American culture, though filled with representations and instances of anger, tends to condition people to regard anger as bad, as something not to be expressed, to be hidden or swallowed. You see this in young children often and research shows that anger is the least accepted emotion in this culture regardless of how pervasive it is (media, games, toys).

I wonder how anyone even Gandhi or Martin Luther King could stand by watching and not feel anger at injustice. This response seems appropriate, neither good nor bad, just what someone would feel who feels for the situation.

These are partly my own views and partly training in psychology, but they are not new in Buddhism. Check out this quote:

"There's nothing about birth or social status that changes this. Anger toward social injustice will remain until the goal is achieved. It has to remain."

Did a militant Marxist, feminist, Black Panther say that? No. His Holiness the Dalia Lama did. Yes, he also says my religion is kindness.

The question is, can anger (moral outrage) be a form of kindness (compassion)?
The way is to get out of the way of the way.
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby flutemaker on Sat Feb 11, 2017 4:21 pm

Guo Gu wrote:ani,
one bad case of transaction and you stop your flute business all together? i hope you continue to make and sell flutes.
regarding the indian who didn't pay you for the flute, why not just consider that a gift?
with a change of perspective, adversity becomes opportunity for you to practice generosity.
will you sell me a flute?
be well,
guo gu

Guo Gu:

On a serious note, the whole story is much much longer, and is way more complicated than would fit into a forum topic. In brief, the last case described (missed a good number of details) was just a concluding event in a long series of troubles, major or minor, inevitably accompanying almost the entire flute making undertaking (or a so-called "business", which of course in reality was not, for I very well knew what the real-life business was, and the real dishonesty, and the harsh "survival of the fittest" business law, and the "thick skin" requirement).

This series of events has been always looking mysterious for me, from the very outset. Thus, making a more or less good profit, an equal (or greater) loss immediately and irreversibly followed. Made $50 bucks? Your wallet stolen the same day, with cash totaling a bit more than that. Made more? Your apartment rent increasing for way much more, the notice arrives the same day. I won't continue, but it REALLY looked like a miraculously bad luck. You are going to update a showcase website? Your laptop motherboard fails within the next 10 minutes, the cost of repair is nearing $300. And so on.

Further, the natural forces seemed to repeat the same pattern. Selling on an ocean front promenade? A huge wave comes out of nowhere, 3 to 4 meters high, and overthrows all your flutes to the ground. A flute on the floor is a flute no more -- there is a saying. Taking into account that the other craftsmen on the ocean front are safe, one would be really head-scratching. The next weekend -- how would you think about that -- yet again a huge wave doing the same thing. The THIRD weekend -- the same story... THAT was a truly mysterious "sign", making me reconsidering the cause and effect laws, and the whole way this world was designed...

This all is just a little bit of the full story. Being solely a fragment of a more broad chain of bad events in other areas of life -- following and unfolding simultaneously. Accepting adversity?...

There was a forum member "unsui", and if memory serves -- her practice was very well grounded, long-term, and her position in a European monastery looked serious. What her sayings regarding Zen were, and its strength relative to even terminal illness, I don't remember exactly, but the impression was all was right there. Yet -- what happened to her, and what her last post was? A family event -- it was too much to bear? Just a family event? Accepting adversity?...

Guo Gu, it would be my pleasure to work with you selecting the right instrument, and shipping it to Tallahassee at no cost for you. My only concern would be, I could transmit all these troubles to you, together with the flute. I am very careful about even thinking of flutes presently, not to say touching them.

Follows is what would be almost an "Irish flute", in Western terms, in the key of D major (the lowest tone D4 all 6 holes closed), or in Hindustani terms this would be a tonic G bansuri (a beginners level instrument, though build on a professional grade level) for in India the tonic is with the 3 upper holes closed. The material is imported (from the Philippines) bamboo, a single section with no inter-nodes, and a new wine cork, total length 575 mm (22.6"), inner diameter: 22 mm (0.87"), base frequency: A=432Hz. Have you ever tried a traverse flute in the young age?
s1a.jpg

s2a.jpg

s3a.jpg
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby desert_woodworker on Sat Feb 11, 2017 8:03 pm

flutemaker,

My copy of the Feb. 2017 issue of PHYSICS TODAY arrived today, and I find in there a brief report and reference to a paper that treats the topic of "Pitch Sharpening in Woodwinds", which a player can put to good advantage on key-less instruments like the Recorder, and the Japanese Shakuhachi flute (and others).

Pitch-sharpening of this kind can be done by a special way of fingering in order to fill-in chromatic gaps on the instrument (which of course has a limited number of holes).

Usually, it's possible to lower, or flatten, the pitch by a semitone by covering one or more tone holes below the first open hole. But an "intonation anomaly" can be created by another kind of cross-fingering in order to raise, or sharpen the pitch.

A German physicist at the Fraunhofer Institute in Stuttgart explains how this works. See the review of his article here, and then, if you like, see the original paper (a free PDF file) by the scientist, Seiji Adachi, at the URL given at the end of the brief review (below); He treats the flute as a system of two coupled oscillators, upper and lower:

http://physicstoday.scitation.org/doi/10.1063/PT.3.3457

--Joe

flute.jpg


hole_model.jpg

.
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby Michaeljc on Sat Feb 11, 2017 8:32 pm

I have been amping to bring up the technical aspects of woodwind instruments. Given that it a little off-topic here I will start another topic.

I play clarinet and had to do an awful of research on not only on how to get the best out of the instrument but technical design and tuning. It is complex.

Flutemaker has touched on the influence of breath. It does relate to zazen in that outcome of both practices can be somewhat similar. I recommend that people interested making music try woodwind. But start with something like what flutemaker produces. Reed instruments are just too difficult for learners. The better the tone you want to produce the harder you have to work. This relates in particular to clarinet.

There is a jazz musician named Jim Langabeer who brought Zen to NZ way back in 1980. He studied under John Daido Loori in the US. He was a very accomplished saxophonist. While at the Mountains and River Monastery he took up some Japanese woodwind instrument thinking that it was going to be a "piece of cake". Apparently it was not. :)
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby flutemaker on Sat Feb 11, 2017 11:18 pm

desert_woodworker wrote:a special way of fingering in order to fill-in chromatic gaps on the instrument (which of course has a limited number of holes).

There are no "gaps" playing a six-hole (as on the picture) or a seven-hole (I make both kinds) Hindustani flute (Bansuri). The "half-holing" (or covering roughly two thirds of a hole) produces the entire spectrum. Especially on a more bass scale flutes, with the playing holes reaching 13 to 14 mm diameter. These flutes have about 750 to 800 mm length. You have to learn Indian classical music theory to see the difference between the Western ("equal") and Indian ("just") temperaments, wherein the later is based on solely pure, natural ratios (1:2, 2:3, 3:4, 4:5 etc.) so that there is no "half-tones" as such, or "chromatic" sequences, but there is rather a great number of "sets" of tones (called ragas) based on which a melody is developed (that always involves improvisation by the flutist). You have to search youtube for example for raga jog bansuri keywords and the likes.
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby desert_woodworker on Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:18 am

Flutemaker,

Physics is Physics, and no exceptions intrude upon the realities of The Only Nature. ;)

Maybe you mean instead that in certain playing, one does not need or want semi-tones. I understand that. But on my 'cello, of course, there is an infinitude of micro-tones, as 'cello is not a fretted instrument. Usually, the micro-tones are not wanted there, either, though. So, we use vibrato, to hide that our intonation is not so great.

:lol2:

--Joe

ps (just pulling your beard). ;)
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby partofit22 on Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:27 am

flutemaker wrote:
Guo Gu wrote:ani,
one bad case of transaction and you stop your flute business all together? i hope you continue to make and sell flutes.
regarding the indian who didn't pay you for the flute, why not just consider that a gift?
with a change of perspective, adversity becomes opportunity for you to practice generosity.
will you sell me a flute?
be well,
guo gu

Guo Gu:

On a serious note, the whole story is much much longer, and is way more complicated than would fit into a forum topic. In brief, the last case described (missed a good number of details) was just a concluding event in a long series of troubles, major or minor, inevitably accompanying almost the entire flute making undertaking (or a so-called "business", which of course in reality was not, for I very well knew what the real-life business was, and the real dishonesty, and the harsh "survival of the fittest" business law, and the "thick skin" requirement).

This series of events has been always looking mysterious for me, from the very outset. Thus, making a more or less good profit, an equal (or greater) loss immediately and irreversibly followed. Made $50 bucks? Your wallet stolen the same day, with cash totaling a bit more than that. Made more? Your apartment rent increasing for way much more, the notice arrives the same day. I won't continue, but it REALLY looked like a miraculously bad luck. You are going to update a showcase website? Your laptop motherboard fails within the next 10 minutes, the cost of repair is nearing $300. And so on.

Further, the natural forces seemed to repeat the same pattern. Selling on an ocean front promenade? A huge wave comes out of nowhere, 3 to 4 meters high, and overthrows all your flutes to the ground. A flute on the floor is a flute no more -- there is a saying. Taking into account that the other craftsmen on the ocean front are safe, one would be really head-scratching. The next weekend -- how would you think about that -- yet again a huge wave doing the same thing. The THIRD weekend -- the same story... THAT was a truly mysterious "sign", making me reconsidering the cause and effect laws, and the whole way this world was designed...

This all is just a little bit of the full story. Being solely a fragment of a more broad chain of bad events in other areas of life -- following and unfolding simultaneously. Accepting adversity?...

There was a forum member "unsui", and if memory serves -- her practice was very well grounded, long-term, and her position in a European monastery looked serious. What her sayings regarding Zen were, and its strength relative to even terminal illness, I don't remember exactly, but the impression was all was right there. Yet -- what happened to her, and what her last post was? A family event -- it was too much to bear? Just a family event? Accepting adversity?...

Guo Gu, it would be my pleasure to work with you selecting the right instrument, and shipping it to Tallahassee at no cost for you. My only concern would be, I could transmit all these troubles to you, together with the flute. I am very careful about even thinking of flutes presently, not to say touching them.

Follows is what would be almost an "Irish flute", in Western terms, in the key of D major (the lowest tone D4 all 6 holes closed), or in Hindustani terms this would be a tonic G bansuri (a beginners level instrument, though build on a professional grade level) for in India the tonic is with the 3 upper holes closed. The material is imported (from the Philippines) bamboo, a single section with no inter-nodes, and a new wine cork, total length 575 mm (22.6"), inner diameter: 22 mm (0.87"), base frequency: A=432Hz. Have you ever tried a traverse flute in the young age?
s1a.jpg

s2a.jpg

s3a.jpg


I can shorten the story for you -- we've shortened it for ourselves here- We call these cascading events Murphy's Law- Anything that can go wrong, will go wrong- It offsets the times when say you toss something and it lands in such a way that couldn't possibly have landed in that manner no matter how many times one might try- Or you're in the right place at the right time, say just walked outside and you just happen to look up and at that very second you see a green meteorite streaking across the sky- Well, that's what we all want life to be like --all the time-

However, sometimes some of us have terrible luck- But perhaps those of us who have had terrible luck have led adventurous lives- Unsui's last post broke my heart to read but Nonin's response to her post mended it directly- The sense of gratitude was instant- And sometimes that's just how it happens- Then again, look at Van Gogh- UGH! And yet .. he kept at it and everyone continues to benefit- Anyone of us who gently suggests you keep going, and do what Ani does or will do, has suffered similarly -- and kept going- If not flutes, perhaps hammered leather sandals- Or a book- Or bee keeping or making mead or .. whatever you're interested in- It is OK to stop making something if you no longer have a joy for it- Have you tried Etsy?
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby partofit22 on Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:30 am

One time I dropped our backgammon pieces ( I wasnt paying attention ..) and we found all but one- We turned the house upside down and shook it- It never turned up-
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Re: The Practice of Accepting Adversity (Suffering Injustice

Postby babybuddha on Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:57 am

Acceptance to me ultimately means be at
peace to the cause and effect of an event or situation
regardless of ones experiences or expectations of the outcomes.

If you eat, poop will follow.
If you get married, divorce or death will separate it.
If you got burned by the fire you wouldn't touch it again.
If you rent an apartment you will pay rent.
If you feel hot now you will be cold later...
If you breath in, exhaling should follow suit.
Walk with the eyes close soon or later shit will happen.

Acceptance, basically to me means is to be at ease to rising conditions.

Here's the fun part...

Through out our lives we picked up this new habit call "attachments".
Like a magnet our brain gets stuck on lots things like money, sugars, sex, success, failure,
toys, spouse, boats, arts, sports, kids, etc.

Basically its our life stories or the past.
Without my histories then what am i?

The mind will never let go of that self identity
after habits of life long conditioning.
Thus acceptance cannot happen in the past or future!

If anxiety arises from thoughts of the past then there is no acceptance.
If worries arise about future delusions  also there is no peace or acceptance either.

If you can't find acceptance in the past or future where do you suppose to find it?


And when you do find it...
One can come to accepting the situation.
This does not mean to do nothing about it.

If a person gets into a car accident...
The person accepts the situation.
This is acceptance.
Deny it won't make the accident go away.

There are only 3 actions a person can do
In any given situation.
Change the situation,
accept the situation,
Or remove from the situation

You can make change by helping injured out of the car or perform CPR.

If you are pinned to the car bleeding then can only
Wait for help or bleed to death.

If car caught on fire, move far away.

Another example:
When the wife is nagging..

Try humor to defuse or change the situation,
Only listen until its over,
Restroom emergency..

All else is just a figment of the imagination.
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